Double Starting Knot Feedback

Double Starting Knot diagram

The Double Starting Knot holds tighter, which is great when tying slippery shoelaces or when learning new knots – especially for kids. Begin as for a regular Starting Knot, then wrap around for a second time.

What Others Have Said

The following are excerpts from some of the many e-mails that I've received about the Double Starting Knot.

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Visitor Feedback

I ultimately settled on “Ian's Secure Shoelace Knot” but with a double starting knot instead of a single starting knot. The double starting knot seems to make the whole thing more secure without adding a lot of volume.

– Phillip G., Nevada, USA, Jan-2022

I discovered the surgeon's knot back in 2005. Will give the “Ian Knot” a try.

I also like the double starter knot. I've found that helps keep the whole thing more secure.

– Mark N., Mar-2020

I am an old man of nearly 65 writing from Germany. I found several useful hints on your site. Especially for elder people is very important to walk safely and an accurate shoelace knot is a useful contribution. So I now always use the double starting knot and finish the knotting with Ian's Secure Shoelace Knot. You are right, since using the secure knot, it has never become undone.

– Reinhard H., Hardegsen, Germany, May-2018

I have typically used a double starting knot because I want it to stay exactly at the tightness that I make it--and I hate it if it loosens even slightly while finishing the knot off.

– Rick S., Michigan, USA, Jul-2017

Particularly with boots with slippery shoelaces, I have a hard time holding the starting knot taut while creating the finishing bow. I try to plant a thumb on it, but I usually end up with a looser shoe than I like. My solution has been to double the starting knot (wrap and feed twice instead of once). This works--there's enough friction that the starting knot holds tight while I add a bow, but it also wears through shoelaces very fast.

– Michael H., Sep-2009

A method I have used for slippery laces is when tying the starting knot is to use two turns instead of one and the same can be done with the bows although your method with the bows is probably more secure.

– Bob M., Newburgh, Scotland, Feb-2008

Instead of a single bight starting knot, use a double. To do that, instead of starting left-over-right, start with left-over-right-over-left. Or the reverse if you favor the other hand. Pull this snug and it creates a stronger base knot. Since it also provides greater surface area for the bow knot to lay across, the bow also stays tighter.

– Tom Reynolds, New Jersey, USA, Mar-2007

The reason I was looking for a shoelace site, is because I thought I had invented a good round lace knot. It turns out to be the double slip knot with the double starting knot. I think that combination is slightly more symmetrical than your version of the secure knot. I doubt that it is anymore secure, but it's easier to teach someone if you use the bunny ear method and say just double the number of turns for starting and finishing.

– Robert E., Ontariao, Canada, Jun-2006

Just wondering if you mention that if you do an extra loop on a starting knot it does not loosen – especially good for kids and if you are stuck with thin slippery laces.

– Stewart D., New South Wales, Australia, Dec-2005

Why don't you make a double starting knot? Wrap the lazes two times around before tighten them makes the start easier and never slip!

– Johan H., Sweden, Sep-2004

When tying the starting knot I would add in another step after step 4. I would once again feed the blue end of the lace through the gap making the starting knot more secure. This way kids don't have to be concerned about keeping the starting knot taut while completing the rest of the knot.

– Jacinta V., Sep-2004

I am a rollerblading instructor here in New Orleans, and I often teach my students a variation on the surgeon's knot to tie their skates. The important thing with tying skates is to maintain the tension from pulling the laces tight, as well as avoiding slipping. To do this, I loop the starting knot through a second time, as with a traditional surgeon's knot, then I use the double wrap of the better bow to keep the knot from loosening. I haven't seen this variant drawn up anywhere, but it is useful when one is trying to keep the laces taut.

– Jeff M., New Orleans, USA, May-2004

One of the biggest problems many small children have is, that while learning to tie their shoes, the starting knot will unravel and the shoe will loosen as they try and tie the binding knot. This can lead to either the shoe coming off or the knot falling apart.

However by making an extra turn on the starting knot this holds the knot in place while less-than-nimble fingers can take their time structuring the binding knot. This is especially useful if the knot is slightly more complexor where you are learning a new knot, as it ensures that the final binding knot isn't weakened through loosening of the starting knot while you try and figure out what goes where.

– Murdo M., New South Wales, Australia, Apr-2004

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This page last updated: 04-Sep-2022. Copyright © 2022 by Ian W. Fieggen. All rights reserved.

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